An argument can be made that all actions people take are for their own self-interest. Even things like helping the community is done for reciprocal benefits for yourself plus the general increase in respect.
Another point is that if all people just act for their own self-interest, they will have a better life themselves, and if everyone does the same, some sort of proper balance will be achieved.
I have been having some occasional discussions with my friends over this. I personally disagree, but would love to hear what others have to say. Feel free to discuss!
The idea that Woke changed the world to be kinder is ridiculous funny. Most people seem to want immediate self gratification and to make money by posting on social media virtue signalling.
I think we have to go back to real poverty to be altruistic eg. the world wars, 1930s recession. A person with literally nothing will give you half of their life savings, even if that’s the change that they have in their pockets, to help you make a phone call.
In a sort of way, yes. Everyone makes the decisions they feel a bit better with, even the selfless ones.
The way you describe, I don’t think so. Maybe if you include “for a good feeling”.
Of course, but their self-interest need not be shortsighted and materialistic. A man who willingly walks into certain death to save those he loves/to stand for righteousness is 100% doing it out of selfishness, as it is in our own interests to live with self-respect, self-esteem and few/no regrets.
Define self interest.
It is in your best interest to invest heavily in childhood education and recruit young people in to the agricultural sector. That is also in society’s best interest. As it happens the only people doing that are those who can see the problem even with short sighted goggles on.
Most people do not look beyond their short sighted goggles. Most of those goggles come with blinders on the sides.
Human civilization as a whole is maintained by people with blinders and goggles on, and we were trucking along just fine, and will continue to do so until we’re standing in ruins of our own making.
I wonder if the fact that human civilization has lasted and flourished for so long is just a stroke of luck then…
It has collapsed before. It will collapse again.
The contextual and memetic aspect of what constitutes a “person’s self interest” far outweights the person’s actual decision and the individual actor cannot be removed cleanly from the wider discussion envelopping what this “self-interest” even is.
The “law” and its detterence logic shapes what “self-interest” is. Talkibg heads shape your understanding of reality and anchor what your self-interest is and means.
Nobody has self-interests in a vacuum.
I got handed an Ayn Rand sandwich,
Straight from a can, it tasted so bland,
I asked the lass to pass me a glass,
of Engels’ Conditons of the Working Class…I think that as long as people’s individualism does not override the freedoms of others, then the pursuit of self-interest frees the mind to explore all kinds of avenues of spiritual discovery.
That’s a big ask though, and most people have different ideas of what is fair when expressing their individuality, so I do think that there needs to be a mediator of sorts to balance the more extreme aspects of our self-interest, and make sure that no one is fully happy but that we’re all kinda happy, in order for us all to progress, even if it’s at a snail’s pace.
War is the least interesting place to look for heros but it is undeniable there, read stories of medal of honor recipients and tell me they pulled off some insane shit because of “self interest”.
No, virtually every gift bestowed upon you by this world is a direct or indirect product of people making the strange choice to act in the interests of the greater good against ridiculous odds when the easier choice was screaming at them to take it. That is how it always begins :)
Another point is that if all people just act for their own self-interest, they will have a better life themselves, and if everyone does the same, some sort of proper balance will be achieved.
Hmmm, I don’t know… I think that kind of “balance” you talk about is obtained rather at that middle point between the individual and the collective interest.
I think we all act to a greater or lesser extent according to our interests, the problem I see is that we have this idea that life is a zero-sum game, where others must fail for one to succeed, that’s where the conflict comes from, because not everyone can win, there are more losers than winners. A cure for this mentality, I believe, is precisely to think about the collective interest understanding it as “what benefits my community also benefits me”, it is to achieve individual benefit through collective work and cooperation, if everyone wins I also win.
There are no selfless good deeds
- Friends TV show
An argument can be made that all actions people take are for their own self-interest. Even things like helping the community is done for reciprocal benefits for yourself plus the general increase in respect.
I believe if the act benefits someone else more than it benefits yourself, then that is what differentiates selfless from selfish.
That’s where the term “Enlightened Self Interest” comes from.
Naive short-sighted stupid self interest is destructive - both to the community and even to the self interested individual.
But self-interest doesn’t have to go away. We all have wants and needs, and most of our wants and needs are harmless.
Instead, self interest can be enlightened - seasoned with understanding of the bigger picture, and with the wisdom of other’s experiences.
Agreed!
I might think it is in my self interest to lie, cheat and steal, but if I do that, my community and my reputation are worsened, and I may have a harder time getting a better position in a crappier world.
If instead I think it in my self interest to volunteer at the local food bank, I might see my community and reputation improved, and by demonstrating a commitment to community, perhaps I will get a better job offer.
More basically: civilization has figured out that fair trade benefits both the farmer who needs tools and the blacksmith who needs food. It is in everyones’ self-interest to support things like: rule of law, commerce, and education.
Of course, you are the only protagonist of your movie and you must chase your destiny. You must follow your heart, and you must be honest to yourself, and you must chase with all your might, and if you’re lucky, you might find who you really are and what it is to be human, and only then do you find out what everyone else is and what humanity is all about, and only then do you find your purpose in life.
I’ve often thought about the idea that there is really no such thing as true altruisim. Because no matter what, you feel good about doing good. Even if you don’t tell anyone about the good thing you did, you still get a good feeling from it, therefore there is some inherent selfishness involved no matter what.
Of course there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. People should absolutely being doing good things and get to feel good about it.
Autistic people will often do the right thing simply because they were taught it is what they are supposed to do - with no consideration of how they’ll feel about it.
And ADHD people don’t get to feel good about anything they do.
Combine the two and you get the ultimate altruists!
(this comment is meant as a joke)
When it’s trash day on my block (city life) and the collectors leave a trash can in an open parking spot and I move that can to the sidewalk, you’re claiming that I’m doing this because it makes me feel good to be helpful to someone I’ll never encounter, and that this isn’t “true altruism”.
So, should we be discussing why we don’t do things that make us feel bad? “True altruism” can’t exist because we don’t go around helping people commit murders or because we’re not voting for a politician we dislike? I don’t think that’s the intent of the word.
I mean, there’s ‘doing things because they make you “feel good”’ and there’s altruism. These are not the same nor are they mutually exclusive.
I think perhaps the word you’re trying to shoehorn into altruism is heroism - when you do something for the benefit of others knowing it’s detrimental to yourself. Or, if you really want to dig into doing things that make you feel bad, I’m not really sure what word that would be. Idiocracy?
As with many things, I think the answer is somewhere in the middle.
You have to act in your own self interest at times otherwise no one is going to prioritise your interests. But at the same time you should at times prioritise other peoples interests so that they will do the same in turn, I love the saying, “treat others how you would like to be treated”
That said, if you only ever prioritise others over yourself, at some points this will be a detriment to you.
However, just because you might try and strike the balance of maintaining your own self interest in tandem with those you care about, doesn’t mean you’ll always strike the right balance or not accidentally prioritise yourself at the detriment of someone else, we are only human after all.
So reading the title I came to say yes with a caveat but you included the caveat. The thing is self interest is ultimately about happiness but humans don’t always understand what brings it. Drug use is sorta the basest level. Chasing literal physcial sensation of pleasure. Sex addiction would be next which is really just chasing drugs that our body naturally makes. Same with danger addiction and such. Then you get to like food addiction. Next is money addicition which is sorta looking at it as a gateway to everything. Recognizing how important others are on different levels means a lot. Its a bit like the hierarchy of needs. You can maybe get physiological on ones own but after that any increase in actual happiness involves having to improve your environment and society and ultimately the earth. So I guess Im saying yes but people can pervert it for not seeing the forest for the trees.
Do as you will as long as you harm none.
