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People Are Increasingly Worried AI Will Make Daily Life Worse::A Pew survey finds that a majority of Americans are more concerned than excited about the impact of artificial intelligence—adding weight to calls for more regulation.
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AI isn’t the problem, capitalism is.
Exactly, AI is only scary if you need a job to survive.
If AI takes work from us, we should be freed by not having to work, not doomed to starvation.
The current economic status quo is entirely unequipped to deal with the next couple of decades, and the options for progressive change are dwindling.
I’m absolutely not calling for revolution right now, but the glacial rate we’re evolving our economy is going to make it inevitable or else we’ll be left with some kind of Mad Max hellscape before the century is out.
I also find AI taking other people’s jobs depressing. Whenever I purchase something or need customer service, I’d always rather interact with a human than AI
More so human nature. Humans are greedy.
That’s a lie capitalism has sold us to justify it’s value system.
Remember how Soviet workers would smuggle parts out of their jobs to reuse themselves? There was a job field filled by babushkas that would inspect workers before they left. Is that the fault of capitalism? I know the people at the top do it much worse, but humans naturally compete with each other.
People are capable of both competition and cooperation.
Capitalism goes out of the way to make the former a value.
Yes, greed is in our nature. But so is altruism. And the idea that people are just greedy by nature, and that all altruism has ulterior motivation, is something capitalists have actively encouraged to justify their values.
So yes, when it comes to greed in the West and how it’s become a value rather than a sin (Jesus eye if the needle parable), I blame capitalism. Of course, if humans didn’t have the capacity for greed capitalism wouldn’t exist.
But to dismiss capitalism as a non-factor at this point in history because humans are greedy by nature, well, it’s propaganda and not based on a modern scientific understanding of human nature.
Yeah that’s fair. I think the truth is somewhere in the middle. We shouldn’t rely on greed to make a system nor altruism alone. The difficult part is actually making a system that works.
The Buddhist economy is essentially a gift economy that has survived for 2500 years.
Shit, our genealogy is also basically a gift economy, and one much more ancient than Buddhism.
Which is my way of saying I think the system is in our nature. If we can learn to embrace life and stop being so terrified of our individual deaths.
The best systems happen organically after all. And without coercion.
They don’t want to look at the big picture, they’d rather focus on rage bait articles
Exactly, let’s worry about the horrible people fucking over the planet first! AI is such an amazing opportunity for distraction, capitalists are gonna capitalize on that for sure!
Specifically capitalism paired with zero sum game mentality.
If someone is convinced the only way for themselves to win is to make other people (including me) lose, that’s where the biggest problems happen.
I would argue that too much centralization in any economic system is the problem.
The general sentiment towards AI in the comments is mixed. There are concerns about the potential negative impacts of AI, particularly on jobs and the economy, but also recognition of the benefits that AI can bring.
Main Points Pro AI:
- AI can make life easier and more efficient, with examples given such as not needing to carry cash or visit a bank, and being able to read library books without going to the library.
- AI can potentially solve problems and provide more tools for problem-solving.
- Some people have jobs that wouldn’t exist without technology, including AI.
- AI can automate mundane and repetitive tasks, freeing up humans to do more creative and complex work.
Main Points Against AI:
- AI can lead to job displacement, with concerns that it will be used to replace human workers, particularly by the wealthy and corporations.
- There are concerns about the potential for AI to be used to exploit the poor and increase wealth inequality.
- Some people have had negative experiences with AI, such as in customer service or automated ordering systems.
- There are fears that AI will be used by those in power to control and manipulate, rather than benefit, the average person.
- There is a concern that the current economic system is not equipped to handle the changes that AI will bring, potentially leading to social and economic instability.
Main points against AI, specifically points #2 and #4, do appear similar. However, I believe these concerns can be alleviated if we, as average individuals, adapt AI into our own contexts. If our current roles could potentially be replaced by AI, we should strive to harness this technology to augment our work. We should take an active role and participate in the changes AI brings, rather than merely being subjects of these changes. While corporations may have access to AI on a larger scale, we too have access to this technology and can utilize it to our advantage. My frustration would stem from a lack of access to these tools, not from the changes they bring about.
I hear you, but aren’t pro-points 1 and 4 something we already have via good old automation? Can it even get any better on those points by using the-technology-currently-known-as-AI?
Same for con-points 1, 2, 4, really. Thinking of automation for point 1 (human assembly lines vs robotic used in car manufacturing, for instance). And stuff like social media algorithms have been around and exploiting one class for the benefit of another for quite a bit now. Though, admittedly, point 4 can always get worse.
AI, or any other tool, isn’t intrinsically bad or oppressive. In my opinion, in this context, it would be more valuable to concentrate efforts towards better work legislation, rather than solely focusing on regulating AI (which needs to be done regardless).
No, people are concerned other people are using AI for dirty shit that will end up making lives harder for 90% of us … you all know which 90% …
AI is making my life way easier and better so far.
Yup so far. It’s the beginning of the curve now when everything is new and awesome.
Enjoy it while it lasts.
Said the same above but will share here too. I actually see that curve another way. We will not need the employers. I used to be an employee and now I am independent and doing the work that would normally require a team of people and big money backing it all up. I think this is going to become more and more apparent as time goes on as while yes, AI will benefit corporations, it also equally benefit individuals. Corporations are the ones who are most in trouble. Cute that they think they are going to be the winners here.
I’ve been a contractor too so I know what you mean. But most people are not and don’t want to be. It’s more risky and most people just want safety.
I agree but we really need to encourage those who think they are in a safe employee job that they are not safe and that they need to start investing in themselves. Something on the side to start, but something. Anything. Even if it fails as you still learn something. The age of employees is coming to an end and the more energy you put into holding on to that is less energy in adapting to the new world emerging. Follow a passion and develop new skills. You can love your work.
I have the same mindset as you and I agree, but I have almost never managed to convince someone else to go into contracting. They don’t want to risk that sweet stable income. :)
Also some of them buy into the entire thing with colleagues being their friends etc etc.
Some of them prioritize family in front of work and want their jobs to be as easy as possible so they can focus on their families instead.
But yes, to me being an employee is the worst form of employment. You usually don’t learn much after the initial year, and you get lazy and stop learning. Your skills are therefore not growing anymore. Getting a new job is harder, and you are likely to accept the first offer once you want to switch.
Right. Plus most of not all employers have this attitude that they own you and can abuse and exploit you as you are there for their gain now.
just wanted to say, username checks out
Its life experience my man :)
So easy that your employers will no longer need you in a year or two.
I actually see it the other way around. We will not need the employers. I used to be an employee and now I am independent and doing the work that would normally require a team of people and big money backing it all up. I think this is going to become more and more apparent as time goes on as while yes, AI will benefit corporations, it also equally benefit individuals. Corporations are the ones who are most in trouble. Cute that they think they are going to be the winners here.
Independent work means no union and no health insurance. It also means you don’t get things like overtime or sick pay.
No thank you.
I have been independent for a long time and pay for all my own benefits and 100% control them versus discovering the reality that your employer has trimmed it over the years. I do not know your situation, but I urge you to start your own thing on the side as the corporate world and its employees is a thing of the former industrial age and. not the one we are heading into. Whatever your passion is, invest time in it and see where it goes.
No thanks, I like job security and health insurance.
Any examples?
I am imagineering a highly detailed VR Theme Park inspired by parks like EPCOT, Disneyland, Universal, Efteling, and worlds fairs. A big part of this is coding and wow…Chat GPT 4 Pro with the code interpreter is saving me a lot of time. My output has speed up 5x over the last month or so. Back in May it would save me time as much as waste with hallucinations, but it has majorly improved with very few hallucinations these days. I can tell it what I want and it will spit out the code nearly perfect every time in seconds. The only down side is it cannot work on my larger scripts yet so I still have to write those myself, but it can help with smaller portions of it which still saves me time. Also it is utterly amazing at reading error logs. You know the massive ones with thousands of lines, most irrelevant. It can zero in on the lines I need to know about so fast that that alone is worth the $20 monthly fee. I am loving it. I cannot wait for it to get better as personally I rather not write any code and my core skill is in imagineering and the overall experience.
It’s insane in an education environment, it makes learning new concepts and skills a lot easier. Depending on the subject, it’s like having a teacher with infinite patience.
I can also generate pretty picture now.
every new technology makes life more easy and convenient and noisy and annoying and depressing and bad
I don’t like Worried Al. I want Weird Al back.
Weird Al never went away. He still drops albums from time to time.
Even the occational movie.
He has announced he’s likely finished releasing albums due to timeliness concerns and waning interest in the format. He’ll probably just release singles as he comes up with them from now on.
I’m worried because AI is supposed to be sorting trash, cleaning sewers, and other laborious work. Instead we got AI trying to take the jobs of artists. 🤦🏽♂️
That’s just the most visible part because artists are constantly complaining about it in the news. In fact the news loves reporting doom scenarios for everything (because in the end that’s what the consumer clicks on.)
But for laborious work you just need robots, not AI. Robots already took over a huge chuck of dangerous, laborious work and will continue to take more.
Of course they’re worried. They’re being told to be worried.
Every other technical innovation has made the average person’s life worse. Why would this one be any different?
I have a very well paying job that wouldn’t exist without technology.
I read library books without going to the libtary or carrying around paper, thanks to technology
I pay for stuff without having to carry cash or ever visit a bank, thanks to technology
Cars are technology too, as are flush toilets and furnaces
You don’t sound like an average person.
I’m rather enjoying my electricity, my antibiotics, my vaccines against respiratory viruses, my access to unlimited information and pornography, My ability to drive cars that are pretty reliable, my ability to travel anywhere in the world at any time at doable prices, technology has treated us pretty well.
I agree. I think tech progression has been mostly beneficial, but I could do without DRM and centralized social media.
You are on lemmy most likely posting it on a Linux device using Firefox.
I am not sure what to say except people continue to make the decision that they would like a bit of convenience and pay for it with money or data vs free as in free bear and deal with the lack of support.
Yeah the real problem with AI is its still in its infancy and CEOs are firing people over it. Thats not a good look.
You are getting at the actual nature of the problem, unlike silly OP.
The problem isn’t AI itself. It’s that capitalists are going to use it as a tool to pay the rest of us even less with.
Though the correct answer is NOT the luddite, “let’s hate the tech”. The correct answer is: Let’s regulate the greedy f*cks who will use it to screw us over.
If only we could create a society that was not at the whims of the ultrawealthy. Unfortunately, many will pin the blame on the technology instead of those siccing it on their jobs. AI just is, LLMs do nothing on their own. If you lost your job to AI, a human made that decision as of right now.
Down with all kings but King Lud!
But for real opposition not to technology existing but to the effects it will have on society, especially skilled workers, and to the nature of who will benefit from that trade is the closest stance to the Luddites. They were skilled laborers who had a problem with being replaced by machines and unskilled laborers all for massive profits.
The Luddites did indeed identify the problem of them bejng cheaply replaced, but then they fought against it in the worst of ways. Trying to ban the use or literally destroying things is pure stupidity.
For AI specifically, things like making sure LLM and other linear algerbra style “AI” creations cannot be copyrighted will do a whole lot more to ensure AI won’t be completely exploited. The tools WILL be used. Make sure they cannot be used as a replacement for making money.
Adapt or die🤷🏿
Username checks out
I guess I could’ve made the cutoff like 100 years ago instead of infinite.
What an absurd thing to think.
Great counter argument lol.
Let’s take a moment to appreciate how ridiculous claim you’re making here.
Every other technical innovation has made the average person’s life worse.
Washing machine. Let’s hear how that made everyone’s life worse.
I might as well argue that the sky is blue. There are countless ways technology has benefited humanity, it’s sort of ridiculous to say otherwise outside of some thought experiment.
It’s also an option to not say anything.
Sorry, when someone says something ridiculous I can’t help but call it out. Call it a character flaw if you like.
Gives advice, doesn’t listen to own advice. Nice.
I said that it was an option. Not that it was required.
The aquaduct…
What have the Romans done for us lately
nice shoes and cars mostly
This is not true. You are living in a warm house and have fresh water and food and a lot of nice furniture. We don’t think about these things but that’s because they are default now.
That’s a lot of assumptions. Poor people don’t go on the internet?
deleted by creator
I think in recent years a lot of “innovation” has been pure marketing fluff and had no real potential to change the world. This one really might. I’ve tempered my expectations, because tech bros really want us to believe there is magic to AI, but eventually it might actually change the world.
No other innovation has been able to replace human creativity or general human thought. Computers came close but they required specialized knowledge to build AND to use so displaced workers had an opportunity to adapt and upskill.
displaced workers had an opportunity to adapt and upskill.
Learn to code.
This isn’t really what happened or how the world works at large.
People are increasingly worried, full stop.
Doom loop news cycle doesn’t help.
I think people have always been like this. Listen to any two people talk, it is just natural that they will talk about something that makes them nervous. It is like salmon returning to the spawning ground, humans discussing fears.
I remember when we had the word Neurotic. And it described someone frankly more sane than anyone I know now.
Social media even moreso than news, for younger audiences. Doom posts gets engagement.
So what should we do instead? And no, going outside is not an option.
Cheer up, it may never happen.
Learn, don’t just watch news. Get perspective.
Go to any McDonald’s drive thru with the automated ordering. You will realize it is already making life worse.
How can having more tools to solve problems make things worse? I can’t think of any problem in my life that more tools and methods would work against solving it.
How can having more tools to solve problems make things worse?
Depends on who’s using it and for what purpose.
in my life
This isn’t about you.
It never is I noticed.
Well, for one clearly this creates more mechanisms to exploit the poor. Especially if we chose to regulate as slowly as we have with other tech in the past.
What problems will get solved? “Our ads aren’t effective enough? We have to pay people to do things when we could be putting it into profits? We’re charging less rent than we think people will pay, but we don’t know how much? People have gotten savvy to my latest scam.”
The capital holding class will be the ones using ai to their benefit. The dishonest will join them. We may get some concessions here and there, but they own them.
in my life
You aren’t the only one with access to these tools. Yeah if I and I alone had ai that wouldn’t be bad. But the people who used to run Nigerian Prince scams now have ai. Advertisers have ai. The bosses who want to cut jobs have ai. The cops who want to ensure there’s no revolts from the folks getting fucked by the system have ai. So yeah I don’t think I can get nearly as much out of it as the people who want to use it in ways that will/could negatively impact me will. So I’m not excited for it or happy about it, and I’m terrified because the people who seem really excited about it seem blind to it’s weaknesses
Seriously though you can’t think of a single way it will massively benefit regular people?
Not really. It hallucinates so much I don’t use it for factual information. It has massive glaring issues in applications like driverless cars. I suppose that applications like a driverless train would be nice but it’s not something I expect anytime soon. I suspect I’ll be told to like it when it tries to get me to consume more.
Maybe better ai in video games will be nice.
Maybe I’ve just become a cranky old lady, but while I can acknowledge actual theoretical value in it when I hear ai hype it feels like listening to crypto bros at worst and at best like listening to an executive telling me I need to implement lean manufacturing and plugging their ears when I want to discuss the costs and risks.
Are you only thinking of current LLMs and not expecting them to improve?
I first rode a train without a driver about twenty five years ago so I think you’re a little behind on that one, they have pilotless planes too, there’s a lot of clever stuff going on.
I totally get that feeling that everything exists to make you consume more but what if an AI could help you consume less and more healthily? If it could reduce waste by using more efficient ways of doing things? If it could give you access to better things at a lower price and with less manufacturing related environmental issues?
What is it could sum up all the information on a product you need to buy like saying ‘there are 3674 adverts for proprietary models however consumer testing demonstrates one of these cheaper open source models would be more effective for you needs…’
If it could actually give you the information you need and filter out at the advertising junk?
If there was evidence AI was heading that direction at all, that direction was where society wanted to move AI to, and that there was the understanding we absolutely aren’t there yet… I’d be significantly more optimistic.
My problem is that currently, Machine Learning and Expert Systems are being implemented quietly by a number of companies to at best to improve their own commercial offerings and at worst to cut their human staffed support teams to ribbons. Nearly everyone can relate to frustrations of seeking support with an automated system instead of a human. Those situations have continued to get worse, instead of better, as this tech has grown.
Additionally, thanks to how convincing LLMs are at appearing intelligent, they’ve become a fad rather than being evaluated and appreciated for what they actually are. There are countless startups now who are just trying to cash in on the hype by using the ChatGPT api to offer products that just shove GPT at all sorts of entirely unsuitable use cases.
Lastly, there are a good deal of issues with the currently most popular AI tech, LLMs, that the industry appears to have no intention of attempting to address in good faith. The complete disdain for copyright, IP, or even fair use when it comes to the data the models have been trained on. The recent articles stating that in order to remove material from a dataset would require effectively rebuilding the LLM. The lack of methodology to get true sources for the data used in responses, lack of reproducability of responses, lack of any auditability of these systems because that would jeapordize the “secret sauce” or is just simply impossible on a technical level. And when most people discuss this they get shouted down by the “true believers” as just not understanding the technology rather than any attempt at discussion in good faith. If you have concerns you’re either stupid or against technological advancement. Don’t you see all the good this could potentially do in the future but it it isn’t doing yet?
I would love for the type of trustworthy, helpful digital assistant it sounds like you’re describing. I’ve wanted that technology for well over a decade. We’re just not there yet.
That sounds really nice and we get to the root cause of my issue here: I don’t think that that is what will happen. I’m not saying to ban the stuff or anything but when I see how it’s being sold to the investors I’m not seeing reasonable and achievable plans of action that benefit everyone. I’m seeing gimmicks, ads, and moonshots. All while the dishonest are getting a lot out of it. I’m seeing it at its most effective being a means to increase the power of the capital holding class because that’s who’s investing in it and I don’t think that training such things will get cheaper.
And I expect them to improve yes, but I’m also concerned with methodological failures. And I’m not saying that it’ll never make life better, but right now in 2023 I’m not impressed by what I’m seeing. And that’s before I get into the realm of the tendency for trends like this to blind policy makers and business leaders. Hyper loop was sold as being for autonomous vehicles and specifically made to not be cheaply convertible to a known better solution. The whole fucking cloud computing craze comes to mind as well.
I will cede one thing here though. I do think it has a lot of room for use as one of many engineering tools to help with the design process. Being able to directly compare to known optimization methods is always going to be useful and if it can automatically plug a layout or process into a model it would be nice. Idk if I expect that to happen as well as anyone seems to think though.
I guess I just don’t trust the tech industry anymore. When I see something like LLMs it seems gimmicky as hell and a lot of early adoption is either minor or harmful. I see driverless cars getting priority over public transit over and over despite the fact that they’ve been 5 years away since I was a kid. I see people talking about using AI to help the fight against climate change from the same people who won’t quit meat. Meanwhile surveillance increases, wages stay stagnant, and the world keeps getting hotter. Contrary to how I sound I love technology. I’m an engineer for a reason. But there’s just so many reasons to feel skeptical of it. So yeah enjoy your hype. If it winds up useful for someone like me I’ll try it. But I’m not buying into the hype and I’ll be skeptical of it until I start seeing actual results.
Ha yeah I agree on all that, well one thing I disagree with but yes people who pretend to care about the environment but eat meat are annoying and scammers pushing their big money making ideas in our faces nonstop is infuriating, but honestly it’s the same with gardening - I get endless bullshit adverts for garden gadgets which do nothing but make the job harder, trying to trick people into giving you money is the culture we live in.
What I disagree is that it’s only the rich getting access to this, most of the actually important stuff is open source. I’m not just taking about how Adobe’s image gen is trash compared to a well set up SD, the knowledge of how to train and the tools to make NNs are all open source. The cost of training is high but the cost of writing Wikipedia would be astronomical if it was written by paid staff, chatGPT cost about ten million to train using current technology which is a lot money but the pet toy market is 7.5 Billion annually, the video game content revenue is fifty billion a year - as things progress training will get cheaper and more community projects will get made, hopefully we’ll see people learn to support organisations that contribute to the commons rather than create walled gardens.
AI design tools are going to make it incredibly easy for people like me who design 3d printable things and share them on thingiverse, that alone will undermine a lot of shitty corporate monopolies and help change the structure of society for the better - imagine being able to just ask your computer to find a template for an item you need then describing how you went it customised, having the ai sort out all the strength and materials stuff then being able to print it or farm the job out locally.
An AI that knows the content of a billion adverts but also the little things posted on random corners of the internet which do exactly what you need and don’t come with any bullshit - it could be what we need to cut through the nonsence that flooda us.
But yeah I’m not asking you to like Sam Altman or any of those techbro silicon valley capitalist cultists - we need open source and free AI for the people by the people.
If you manage to keep your job then sure, you’ll be way more efficient. I guess AI will help you with your job search and resume if you’re laid off, but maybe companies won’t need as many people as they used to. 🤷
Nah my job is already heavily automated. All more will do is let me go even faster
No, the point of AI is not that you work better, faster and more efficiently. The point of AI is that you will not be necessary anymore.
If we were at that point there is nothing left to discuss.
Ask the thousands of information laborers, some who might’ve think the same as you, who no longer have a job because they were layoff when the manager got swindled by OpenAI marketing.
Man a lot of people seem to know what I do for a living without me saying a word about it.
“It doesn’t affect me, therefore it is not a problem. Fuck those people, I got mine.” The absolute lack of empathy of some.
I don’t know if it’s just me or what, but I don’t think AI, and eventually androids, replacing humans doing awful grunt work is really bad, it’s a system that refuses to figure out a way to tax corporations using AI to support those displaced workers.
For decades it’s been the grunt work that was automated and outmoded. Suddenly it’s highly educated individuals that are nearing the chopping block.
The AI is in the hands of interests who think you are the problem.
(They don’t like me either.)
“[Eli] Whitney believed that his cotton gin would reduce the demand for enslaved labor and would help hasten the end of southern slavery. Paradoxically, the cotton gin, a labor-saving device, helped preserve and prolong slavery in the United States for another 70 years.”
As always, the problem aren’t the tools. It’s the psychopath executives, marketers, venture capitalists, etc, that are going to bring us Boring Dystopia 2.0 by using these tools mostly for evil. It’s already happening. It’s going to speed up, and it’s going to permeate everything. Massive layoffs, intrusive surveillance, misinformation, etc.
Combined with the Internet of Shit…it’s going to suck in brand new ways. And then people will be surprised and wonder how we got here.
Because everything is full of rediculous doom scenarios that don’t even make sense and no one talks about the great things it enables.
That picture fucked me up tho
Trumpy smooches
